• Archive through April 12, 2002 April 12 - 05:19 pm [20]

Walter:

These two places had Liang Zhen Pu's book in stock a month or so ago:

http://qi-journal.com/
or www.bltsupplies.com

Plumflower Press hasn't had it in stock for a year or so.

Tim,thankyou for connecting me to affor mentioned
person I was searching for.I greatly appreciate it. I am so happy to have finally found him again.
Thankyou for this site wich was of so much help to me personally.

Tim,sorry to be such a bother,but;
would doing the circle form I was shown and the
other forms from the previous smith book be
compatable/healthy to do in the same workout?
(I.E. circle form and linear Gao sets)
Excuse me if my terminology is incorrect.
I am just concerned because I read in another
publication of health problems arrising from
the mixing of techniques/styles.
Is the mixing of them safe/wise?

P.S. wich form of circling palms would be more correct with the liear gao chains,considering
that the circle form I learned wasn't gao anyway.

Jeff,
The Songs and Verses are attributed to Dong Hai Chuan (at least they are reported to be a record of his actual teachings). I cannot guess who originally said what. I helped clean up some of the translations before the book was published, but I don't have a copy of the original book.

Bill,
I can't imagine why mixing different exercises (providing they are sound to begin with) could cause any problems.

It's just that the 36 seem so rich and full while the 48 are more on the surface.

You actually helped with the book by Huang Guo Qi? Excellent. I think that it should be re-published. It's one of the only valuable books on bagua I have seen. Sorry, I don't own yours yet. You can bet I'll pick them up. BTW, it was only the 6th song I thought was way off. The rest are close enough.

Tim,Thankyou.

Thanks to Tom and Anvar for the info as to where to fund the book. I ordered it from Amazon and also found Sun Lu Tang's book on Xing I while I was there.

Tim,

According to Pa Kua Chang Journal Vol. 4 No. 2, at least 31 of the Gao style Hou Tian techniques are the same as those published in the book Ba Gua Zhang Tu Shou by Yen De Hua, another student of Zhou Yu Xiang. However, C.S. Tang's website describes how Gao learned his post-heaven skills from the Daoist Song Yi Ren as a matter of fact. What is your understanding of the origin of the Gao style Hou Tian forms?

Thanks,
Steven

As far as I know, the Sung Yi Ren story is a fabrication.

The most reliable historians believe that Gao created the Hou Tian forms, combining the Ba Gua he learned form Cheng Ting Hua with techniques from his former training in Xing Yi Quan and Shaolin Hong Quan.

Tim,

You once told me that there is really only about thirtysomething techniques in Ba Gua. What did you mean by that? And, are those techniques the same ones contained in Yen De Hua's book?

Steven

Well, I meant there were only 30 or 40 basic "types" of application. From those, you can make up an almost unlimited number of "techniques." Yen De Hua'a book has a good number of basic applications from the Cheng style.

Tim,

Can you give me an idea of what you mean by 'type of application' vs. an actual 'technique?' Also, how are these 30 or 40 basic applications incorporated into the Gao style Hou Tian forms? Thanks.

Steven

Throwing someone over your hip is a "type" of throwing technique (application). The basic mechanics of the throw will not change for any specific variation of the throw.

Throwing someone over your hip in a head and arm position, or with an over and under arm position would be examples of actual (specific) "techniques."

The basic applications are the foundations of the Hou Tian forms.

Tim,
You say, "As far as I know, the Sung Yi Ren story is a fabrication...."
At, http://cstang.www3.50megs.com/gao.htm , it seems that Gao Yi Sheng, himself, is invoking Sung Yi Ren. Do you know anything about the manuscript, "Yu shen Bagua Lian Huan Zhang" (Swim body Eight Diagram Linking Palm)?