Relationship of Ba Gua Zhang to Xing Yi and Tai Ji.

Tim's Discussion Board: Ba Gua Zhang : Relationship of Ba Gua Zhang to Xing Yi and Tai Ji.
   By TyRivers on Sunday, February 24, 2002 - 12:47 pm: Edit Post

It is always appreciated when information is obtained that will broaden my underastanding of a particular subject. Hopefully this information will be useful to some of you. The following excerpt was found at ... Wang Shu-chin, who later took over the leadership of the Chung-nan lineage of Pa-kua and Hsing-i from Chang Chao-tung, had, during his youth, been sent by Chang to represent him in a meeting to bring T'ai-chi "back to the basics," and to actively participate by injecting into it elements of both Hsing-i and Pa-kua. In 1929, this "new" style of T'ai-chi Ch'uan was "created" by the T'ai-chi Organizing Committee of the National Martial Arts Academy in Nanking. In formulating what they called "Orthodox (Ch: cheng-tsung) T'ai-chi Ch'uan" (OTC; also called tsung-ho, or comprehensive, T'ai-chi Ch'uan) the committee, working with the fundamental principles of the internal arts, took the combative components of the five styles of T'ai-chi then prevalent-the Ch'en, Yang, Wu, Sun, and Wu (Hao) styles. The great masters of each of these styles who gathered together to establish this form were attempting to return the art of T'ai-chi to its original "martial art" form; and, indeed, the main special characteristic of OTC is that none of its postures contains any useless movements (in terms of martial applications). Wang Shu-chin played a very active role as a member of that committee, and was instrumental in infusing the fundamentals of both Hsing-i and Pa-kua into the 99-pose long form.

Do the other systems of internal martial arts build upon each other? It appears this Tai Ji has elements of Xing Yi and Ba Gua imbedded in it. After practicing Tai Ji for a while the student has already learned some of the basic elements of Xing Yi. Xing Yi further prepares the student to learn Ba Gua. Are there other forms of the internal arts that are this interrelated? If this style really did pull all the combative elements from the others does that mean it is a more advanced fighting style? Any input will be greatly appreciated.

Ty Rivers

In search of the truth.

   By Buddy on Sunday, February 24, 2002 - 03:49 pm: Edit Post

Actually I think there is some dispute about Wang's participation in this. Many sources credit Chen Pan-ling with teaching Wang his Taiji.

PS SYSOPS, should my post about Lo's upcoming workshop have gone elsewhere?

   By SysOp on Sunday, February 24, 2002 - 04:13 pm: Edit Post

Yes, read about advertising on the board. Topic: Advertisements and Notices. Resend what you want posted to Tim or I. I have no problem on what you want posted but I want procedures followed.

   By Tim on Sunday, February 24, 2002 - 07:18 pm: Edit Post

I believe the form you are referring to was created by Chen Pan Ling. Wang Shu Jin learned it from Chen. The form follows the sequence of Yang Tai Ji, with elements of some of the other major schools of Tai Ji Quan (Wu and Chen styles) mixed in. It isn't a combination of Tai Ji Quan, Xing Yi Quan and Ba Gua Zhang.

   By Rob on Monday, February 25, 2002 - 10:59 am: Edit Post


I'm wondering if the Chen Pan Ling form uses back weighted stances?

From my limited experience with the form of Wang Shu Jin, it uses primarily a back weighted stance (San Ti).


   By Tim on Monday, February 25, 2002 - 07:52 pm: Edit Post

Hi Rob,
The Chen Pan Ling form has both front weighted and back weighted stances, much like the Yang form. For example, postures that issue power forward (Ward off, Push, Brush Knee Twist Step...) use the standard Gong Bu (Bow Step).

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