Hi Tim,

is there a book with some Sun Style Tai Chi Applications?

I can identify apps for many of the Sun movements, but i have trouble to find one for the "open / close hand movements" which appear many times in the form, also i have some trouble to understand the first movement in the form, where the arms reach out and then you turn.

Can you give me a hint?

Karl

Karl,
One of Sun's daughter's books has descriptions of some of the techniques.

The first open/close in the form followed by the Single Whip is used as an escape from a rear, overarm bearhug to a throw. This is the standard technique usually taught.

The opening is a projection from a double wrist grab. The turn to the Lazy About Tying Clothes movement is used to move outside a straight punch to the face, deflect the punch, check the elbow then strike the opponent's face with a straight palm strike.

Hi Tim,

thanks for your answer!

Can you explain this one a little bit more. I dont get it:

"The first open/close in the form followed by the Single Whip is used as an escape from a rear, overarm bearhug to a throw. This is the standard technique usually taught."

I dont understand the throw part.

Karl

ps. Sorry for posting in the wrong forum.

kai and he

You lean back into the opponent, and lift your elbows out to the side to slide the opponent's arms up to your upper shoulders (open/close). Then you step your left foot around to the opponent's rear (behind his right leg) and lean into him (to your left) as you strike with the back of your left elbow, throwing him backward over your left leg (Single Whip)

Hi Tim,

thanks a lot!

Karl

Hi Tim,

could you please explain an application of "jin bu zhi dang chui (advance and punch)" or is it realy just a punch?

A few movement later there is a movement where you lift the knee and then turn (just before the last lotus kick in the sun form). Could you please explain this one also?

Thanks in advance,
Karl

Normally the jin bu zhi dang chui is used to parry or slip (duck outside) a straight punch and then counter with a simultaneous punch downward to the opponent's pubic area.

Tui Bu Kua Hu is used to evade a straight punch and pull the opponent into a knee strike to the ribs.

Hi Tim,

could you please give one or two examples of applications for "Fist under Elbow" in Sun Style Taiji Quan?

Ben01

beno1,

The Fist Under Elbow technique in the Sun style is basically the same as the Yang and other styles, an opponent throws a right straight punch at your face, you slip outside the attacking arm as you step forward with your left foot and check outside the opponent's right elbow with your left palm as you simultaneously move in with a straight punch to the opponent's ribs (your punching arm moves below the opponent's right arm).

Hmmm, and that is exactly the same as the standard Wing Chun defense for a straight right punch. At least as I was taught it.

Hi Tim,

thank you!

One more question. In the Form while doing "Fist under Elbow" the Torso points a little bit to the right, while the fist points to the elbow on the left side.

This way you cannot put the torso power behind the punch. Is this just in the form or also in the application?

Maybe this is a different type of punching where you dont turn the torso "into the direction of the punch"?

Thank you,
ben01

In the Sun form, the weight is transferred to the front leg and the torso squares up behind the punch (just like the application). Maybe you are describing the Yang style variation.

Tim,

Some of the guys over on EF were curious about how Sun Style is actually fought with - and how it differs from both other forms of tai chi as well as XY. I've summerized their questions here...

"So what is the characteristic flavor of Sun Taiji applications? E.g. stick to the attack and attain close range distance then lock/throw? etc.

How is the follow-step used? Fa jin?

Does Sun Style look/feels like slow-moving xingyi? Are the apps the same as in XY?"

The Sun Style is like other styles of Taijiquan in application, favoring close contact work. There are a range of throws and takedowns, as well as strikes. There may be less chinna than in some of the other styles.

There is certainly a Xingyiquan influence on the form, but I wouldn't call it Xingyiquan in slow motion. You can achieve that effect by doing Xingyiquan in slow motion.

Sun Style Open Close, ref the bear hug, make sure they are not locking bear hug at around your elbow joints and get their centre below yours and are very strong wrestler good at suplex throw... or your up •••• creek without a paddle!!!!

I thought the open close movement of Sun Style was to train/guide the body (over many many repititions) for fali/fajing useage of Kao & Zhao (along with excellent heath benefits)... at least thats what I was told by someone who also studied with Madam Sun... the application is maybe secondary to what the open close movement is developing? After all, all fali is just open and closing, no ?

does anyone else smell a rat?

Hi Tim,

could you give a few examples how the rooster in Sun Taiji is used in application?

Do you have any plans to publish a book or dvd about Sun Style apps? For any style is something out there, but for Sun there is nothing.

Mushin

What Rooster in Sun Taiji???
Jake

Come on Jake ;-)

geng ji du li "chicken stands on one leg"

Mushin