Does anyone know if there is much difference between Carlson Gracie's Jiu Jitsu and Helio Gracie's, as Carlson learnt from his father and Helio mentioned that he modified what he learnt. I hope I have the facts right. Tim, anyone? I was just wondering.

Craig

Craig,
In general, Carlson Gracie's JJ is somewhat more power oriented (not to say it isn't as technical).

I believe Helio's modifications were due to his small stature, and relative lack of strength.

Thanks for the info Tim. I just started BJJ here in Hong Kong, but in a couple of months i'll be moving to Chicago and want to continue to train BJJ. I know that there is Carlson Gracie's school in Chicago and also a purple belt under Rickson teaching in Chi, but as i'm a pretty small guy I wasn't sure which one would suit my stature better. Do you think that it wouldn't matter what school I went to or would Helio's system be better suited?

BTW it was quite an eye opener to see how easily some of the guys in my class could choke me or get me to tap, relatively quickly. I did find it helpful having a bit of trainning in systema groundwork though, as I think it helped me out of a few situations. Although my experience in BJJ is very limited, I do feel that the non-cooperative sparring in BJJ has been one of the biggest if not the asset to me and I surprisingly already feel a little bit more confident about what I can and can't do on the ground.

Craig,
I'd suggest looking at both schools and then deciding which one suits you better.

Thanks for the suggestion, Tim.

tim you're a BJJ black belt right?
in the lines of the egg and the chicken,
do you guys think that one should learn with the
GI first or without a GI first.
to GI or not to GI.
some say that learning with the GI first will
help learn the basics easier,then start no-gi.

i think that if you first learn to control someone by holding his body in the right places
with the right pressures,then if you put a GI
on it will be piece of cake to control him
with grip all over.
i started as a BJJ guy ,now i do MMA and i wonder
what good really did all this fancy gi stuff and
chokes.(i know it could help for street fights
in the winter)
what are your opinions on that,not just tim
anyone!

GI or no-GI??????

Marc,

We train both. If your goal is to compete in no-gi grappling tournaments only, you never need to wear the gi. If you want to compete in jacketed grappling or ever expect to be in a street fight with non-naked men, gi practice is a good idea.

"..be in a street fight with non-naked men"

remember "gi-less" doesn't mean shirtless, but often training in the "actual" clothes you normally wear, oppose to a gi-jacket. I just wanted to clear that up.

my point was that if you can control without
you can control with it.
regardless of your goals!

the gi gives your opponent a much better chance of controling you.

so?

Your point was "if you can control your opponent without a gi, you can control with a gi" - I was pointing out that a gi may make "controling your opponent" surpisingly frustrating because your opponent has more options for controling you while you're trying to control them.

It doesn't matter. Just thought I'd chime in.

so? if i can't control him as good,
he can't control me as good.
back to square one.
if you learn to control with and then it's taken away,what do you do?look like royce?

The point is, if you have never grappled with any type of uniform, you will not be prepared for the much greater number of grips that will be available with the cloth.

Case in point: When the early Greco-Roman and Catch wrestlers in Europe (primarily England) first encountered Judo fighters 100 years ago, they lost virtually every match when made to wear the gi. The wrestlers had excellent no-gi gripping and controlling methods, they just didn't know what to do when confronted with fighters that had the same level of skill with a jacket.

Since, in general, people in the street wear clothes, it is a good idea to learn how to deal with them grabbing your clothes (and they will) and how to use your grips most effectively.

why in the world did they wear the gi?
why the judo guys didn't take theirs off?
what did the indians do against guns?
they lost!
but what if they would of fought hand to hand?
lets nuc'em all!!!!!

excellent point marc. If i follow your logic then, the key to supremacy in hand to hand combat is ever better technology? he brings a knife, i bring a gun?

I'm glad Jason is following the logic.

I had a hard time connecting the dots from grappling with a gi to nuclear attack.

why play the enemies game?
if you're fighting someone that can nuke you
at will,then hide in the mountains or anywhere else they can't find you!
what happens if your opponent doesn't want to
wear the gi and he doesn't have to?
what happens if you're used to grabing the gi
and then it's gone?
my point was no one will ever fight without
his arms,legs and neck!
but anyone can take a jacket off(gi)!!!!!

"but anyone can take a jacket off(gi)!!!!!"

Right. When was the last time you saw someone take their clothes off in the middle of a street fight.