Many times I've seen martial artists trying to extinguish candles with their punches and kicks. What is the reasoning behind putting out a candle with punches? Why not just punch and kick a heavy bag?

You can buy a whole lot of candles for less money.

It works better if you relax on the punch, with accuracy.

Trying to extinguish a candle flame is meant to teach the practitioner to 'snap' his blows. A snappy punch or kick (one that reverses direction very quickly) will create a momentary vacuum which will cause the flame to extinguish from lack of oxygen.
Or, you could punch a heavy bag.

candles? there are 2 levels,
....snap and snuff it out; with time you can put it out at over 1 meter distance with a point-pulse.
....point and wish; this is qi-polarity-transferrence;
2-levels: low-level is point and the flame goes out;
high-level, the flame will bend only,...in the direction of your intent; getting it to bend to you is the more difficult one.
As for hitting a heavy bag, if you have your 'inners' in balance, the bag will not rock or sway, ••••• should recoil straight up and down. ps.
the candle game is the better one.

the only time a heavy bag wont rock or sway is when the person hitting it has no power! and the only time a bag will recoil up and down is when you hit it on bottom.

I have experienced what Mr. Foxx is talking about, I think. Hmmmm Am I achieving a modicum of balance or do I have no power?

Egads Chris you must be right I have no Power!!

Well I'm just telling you what I have seen from hitting a bag plenty myself, and being in professional boxing gyms and watching top boxers hit a bag-There wasent' so much up and down going on- it's funny but the better the boxer got the more the bag seemed to move! I know this is contrary to the "Laws of chi", but here on earth when you push something with force, it acts with an opposite and equal reaction (if somethig pushes it horizontally-it's not going to move virtically!!). If you would care to show me how this stuff works with your modicum of ability, I'm at tims every saterday, You hit the bag, then i'll hit the bag, and if your still not satisfied, i'll let you hit me, then i'll hit you.

-Chris

When I use Chi punch on a common heavy bag- the bag only shudders- then, exactly 1 second later the bag begins to crack and disintegrates completely.

I have to be very careful. I'd go broke replacing bags with every chi punch and have become the baine of local boxing gyms.

Some say Chi power is a gift. Those who have it think of it a curse. That is why it is hard to find someone who'll really teach true Chi power.

Bob #2

I will try to keep my most potent weapon(sarcasm) in check.
There are different ways to punch which generate different directional effects. I know a western boxer can punch very hard, even internally for some. It's not what they are training for though.
Chris, I think if that is an off handed challenge, you are pretty safe due to the # of time zones between us. Don't worry, I am not coming to your gym.
Since you only know one way to punch and don't want to hear about others, that will be all.

You may go now.

Hi,

there's no reason to respect in order to disagree. Anyway, imho, what you see happening to the bag and the reasons someone gives for that happening might have nothing to do with each other. K.Foxx's bags may lift or go up when he punches them using different techniques, and he gives the reason as Qi. We can agree on the effect, but not agree on the reason. Anyway, it would be helpful to see the type of bag we're talking about. A hard one strung on a chain will react differently from a softer one strung with cord or suspended at both ends.

Anyway, I'd be interested in hearing "why" a qi punch will raise a bag.

respects,
Steve James

Oops, meant "disrespect"

Oh, where? At the beginning or at the end?

LOL,

ow, ya got me. At the beginning, of course.

no disrepects,
Steve James

Dear mingmen,
I Would like to know what it is that "internal" people are training for if it's not power. What makes some boxers "internal" punchers? What is your deffinition of internal? What magic do you think happens when "internal" people hit something? Do you know what your talking about?

-Chris
P.s. I was not worried, but thanx for careing.

In real simple terms, how you are standing/aligned dictates the affects of a punch. We are not training necessarily for different results.
A big strong guy can punch strongly even if his technical ability was sub-par, No?
A smaller guy or women has to put a lot more effort into training alignment and how to most effectively deliver the punch, so far we agree no?
We both want to deliver this punch with as little wind up as possible, Yes?
Steve James has a point too, that people who use different terminology could still be talking about the same thing. Also, I do not have an explaination why the bag does this but it is a hanging from chains type probably between 90 and 100 lbs. I am hitting it dead center i.e. not on the bottom as Chris said was a possible explanation.
Chris,
I guess something can be internalized with practice over time. The longer the boxers career, if he continually works on improving/economizing his movements, he may refine his ability. Remember, most boxers are out of the game by 30 something. In the olympics in their teens. Enough time for the basics but not enough for refinement of the skills.
My last analogy is a truck travelling at high speed hits you. The results are probable death. You may have been thrown 100 feet, or not.
A smaller truck driving in a parking lot sees you stops but the chassis moves forward on the springs and bumps you. You may not fly but you will probably go straight down and the results may be the same as the first scenario. Still power but different kind.

i'm not an authority by any means, but this question is interesting to me. sometimes when i hit my heavy bag (80 lbs. i think), it bounces vertically off its chains and i have to reset it (much to my annoyance, as it makes me stop and re-set it)and i also am hitting it pretty much center. other times it goes horizontally, as one might expect from a horizontal force. i think i'm hitting it hard, either way. i've heard this debate before, but i don't know how to control the bag by my strikes in this way. is there a difference?

tim, do you have thoughts? best...

ps: i've not had bob#2's experience, but i attribute that difference to his beard, which i greatly admire...

sheesh, if you hit the bag dead center hard and fast enough, rather than sway away from you (absorbing the shock), it kinda folds around your punch (the shock going through it), the top and bottom coming towards you. When this movement reaches its apex, it unfolds the other way, then rebounds a little, each time the movement is a little less, it kinda rattles on its chain, not swaying. Some bags are hard almost like concrete and there is no give. If you hit one of these fast enough, it will bust at the seams (theoretically. I've only seen this happen after weeks of such abuse). It isn't mystical, or rocket science, for that matter.

One simple difference that can be seen externally is that an internalist will not lift their shoulder when punching. An externalist may or may not. they usually do I think. Isn't that so?

There are only three factors that will influence how a bag moves when it is hit: the direction of the force, the intensity of the force and the duration of the force.

The puncher's posture, alignment, or imagined qi power will make absolutely no difference. Why? because the bag in an inanimate object (sure, I've seen Bob #2 talking to my bag. He even asked it out once. But the fact remains).

For example, qi master X curls his tailbone under and hits the bag with an exploding qi palm, a boxer lifts his shoulder and hits the bag with a jab and a layman off the street slugs the bag as he trips and falls. If all three hit the bag at the same angle, with the same amount of force the bag will do exactly the same thing in each case. It makes absolutely no difference how the individual generates the force.

Steve and Kenneth make good points about the type of bags struck. A softer bag will not swing as much as a harder bag. But any bag will react the same to the same kind of force, every time.