tim,

ive been reading a bit about chinese ima's and im just wondering about the concept of wuji, pertaining to combat.

do you teach your students how to use wuji, or do you use it yourself?

p.s. i couldve sworn i saw you at plaza bonita a while back, lol.

What do you mean, specifically, by "using wuji?"

by wuji i mean an empty mind from which you can perform and use your skills in an optimal fashion.

i was just wondering if you had any metods of teaching the state of wuji, such as certain zhan zhuang postures while breathing in a specific way.

also, do you think long distance jogging is more beneficial then a long session of zhan zhuang training?

nevermind, thanks laoshr

Tim's been in New Mexico giving a seminar since Friday. He may not have time/access to the internet.

My understanding of the concept of 'Wuji' is 'a state of nothingness'. The 'Wuji' or standing stake posture is held with the skeleton aligned in such a way that if the meat and organs melted off the body- the skeleton would remain standing because it is perfectly balanced.

This practice helps unify the body and can help the practicioner begin to develop a centered, relaxed and 'heavy' feeling. (Tim has often refered to Wuji as the most important excercise in IMA).

'Wuji' in Chiness philosphy means 'the great void' refering to the time before light/dark ~ good/evil ~ heaven/earth ~ yin/yang came into existence. (interestingly, 'Tai Ji' is the period that takes place imediately after Wuji. A Poet/philosopher who witnessed Yang Luchan demonstrating 'Cotton Fist Boxing' commented that Yang had manifested the nature of 'Tai Ji' and the name stuck.)

Taking all that into consideration- one cannot 'use wuji'. As soon as there is movement or thought- Wuji has passed.

That's just how I understand it- I could be wrong.

Shane

Wow Shamey,

I am almost impressed, you really know something that is interesting. Hey and you did it all by yourself. You get a twinkie.

And you even signed it!

How telling, guess we are just full of ourselves now - just aren't we.

Hooly smokes Beav, what will Walley say? Aw shut up Eddie hes in the bathroom with the Playboy.

Beginners luck...

Now for the grand prize, tell me how to use wiji on the big mat and I'll take you sportfishing in Nicaruaga. Yes a free bus ticket from TJ, a row boat, a drunken toothless guide, all the cheap beer you can swallow and young pussy you can handle (all possible puns intended).

Give it a try big guy, lets see what kinda Renisance man you are.

One of us is certainly full of ourselves.

Fortunetly for me, I've already done all the fishing, beer drinking, bus riding and young pussy handling I ever wanted to (it's been a very good life so far). Rowing a boat with a drunken toothless guide sounds inviting- but I don't know what a "wiji" is nor how to apply it to the mat. So I guess I miss out.

I have to admit; for once you have caused me to chuckle. A hard talking, rabble rouser like yourself calling "fishing" a sport, that's some comedy.

Boy you feel for that one. A wiji is applied to the little mat by yanking your copractitioners jock strap up his butt crack. Gooly gee Wally you shold know that. Sounds like its been wedged in your but crack for deacades. Probally needs to be surgically removed by now.

So how does it feel to be driving the short bus all by your self now that Tim is gone?

And if you are such a monk, then why the photo of the twins. Yes Shamey, you are so above it all. Right...

Unfortunaetly for you you have stoped living, if you everd did? Are you the kinda guy who plays the fifty fifty bet on the roulette table, oh, I bet you don't gamble no more? Go gebntly into the night Sir Shame. No row boats with fish smell on your hook or your fingers or your dick.

Rabble rouser? What are you going to celebrate you 90's birthday soon. And a chuckle, wow, you might even learn to laugh out loud some day.

Very good life? I'm overwhelmed by your gusto and joi de viv. A very good life, well kiss Bud and Kitten good night for me.

As your post describes, all that was good in the past, is no longer good in the present. Do you suffer fron E.D.? Plenty of good stuff for that now. Live a little Shaney, don't have to be such a predictable and boring troglidite.

Are you a P.E. coach?

On a serious note; How do you apply Wu Wei to life on the Big Mat, you know the place that exisits outside of Tim's studio?

Come on at least dazzle me with bullshiet if you cannot deliver the goods.

Ever hooked up with a Blue Marlin? Takes about at least an hour and a half to reel em in and after you are finished with the fight, you get to eat him. Unlike your karate competitins where all you get is a trophy and some social jock support.

Now, what about wu wei off the little mat?

Thought so...

jackiphoo, a preacher friend of mine recently asked me what a hangover feels like. so i had him read a few of your posts.

El V,

My understanding of Chinese is limited to a very few terms. I'm not positive I know what 'Wu wei' is. If you give me the English translation I'll answer you. (I think 'Wu wei' it's means 'honorable conduct' or 'personal responsibility' but that is just a shot in the dark).

I'm sure reeling in a blue marlin is an exhausting task- but that doesn't make fishing a sport. And regarding who's about to celebrate their 90th birthday, I'm not the one quoting 'Leave it to Beaver'.

No no no. "Wu Wei" means staying drunk and spending all your time on the internet bragging to people 40 years younger than yourself about your ability to seduce third-world prostitutes.

The proper English translation would be "dissolute."

Wuan-a-bei,

How is the sparring going? Still suffering from ring of fire? By stock in KY (as in jelly).

Shaneless,

Fishng is not a sport? Well if the fish stays on the hook, you are the winner, and if you cannot land him, you are the loser. Winner / loser - sounds like competition to me.

Also sounds like Jack is sportfishing this board and he keeps on reelen em in!

How many San Soo posts now, about a 1000?

Please reply on San Soo thread (I want this to be included in the tally). You know I'm on pay per post. Tim's up to about a few grand in debt by now.


Look it up on the internet, I am sure that's where the majority of your info comes from anyways.

So how do you use Wuji on the big mat? The one outside the studio?

move without thinking

move and 'Wuji' ends. (as I understand it)

So, to answer El me's question:
"So how do you use Wuji on the big mat, the one outside the studio?"

Align your skeleton properly and stand perfectly still for 1-10 minutes daily following warms ups and before and after forms. It has great benefits!

by the way, Jack, you never said what 'Wu Wei' translates to in English so I can answer your question: "how to use Wu Wei on and off the mat"

I belive there is two opposites "wu wei" and "wei wu wei."

One in external movement without conscious cognition.

The other is physical stillness with mental adaptation. Thus remaing unaffected by the external stimulus, so one does not interfere with what is natural, or in accord with the tao.

One is no physical movement - only mental acord.

The other is physical accord with no mental movement.

Simple ehh?

What's yours and Captain Cartmell's take.

How was the weather in AZ Tim?

Shane steered quite well in your absesnce.

I kept an eye on him. Tell him to get out some time. all work and no play makes Jack (I mean Shane, a dull boy.

Mostly laconic, but he wrote something.

Might have to promote him to the long bus. Hey I know its a big decision, but just think about it.

Hey Jack,

It was hot.

Wu Wei literally means "without doing" or "without causing."

It is a fundamental idea of philosophical Daoism. The idea is that non-interference in the natural flow of events results in harmonious relationships between entities within events.

The concept is most often symbolized by "pu" (the uncarved block). Using things according to their natural design will always yield the most efficient outcome, without struggling against the intrinsic nature of any thing.

"Wei Wu Wei" is "to do without doing" or to "accomplish without effort." It was an extension of the the Wu Wei theory emphasized by Zhuang Zi and refers to the application of the principle of Wu Wei to achieve results by flowing with the nature of events. Everyone is floating down the same river. Some try to row against the current and squander their energy to no avail. Others actually "do nothing" and float where the river takes them in a helpless state. The few that understand Wei Wu Wei also go with the natural current, but they understand how to steer the boat.

Thanks for keeping an eye on Shane.

a couple more examples of Wu Wei by Zhuang Zi:

Heaven produces nothing,
yet all life is transformed;
Earth does not support,
yet all life is sustained

another one of my own examples:
this board pays no salary,
yet many lost souls find comfort

Tim, your steering skills are astounding

Haran,

Thanks for taking time away from the ladies to respond.

Now back to work.

Well, well, well we have a knew quire member, Does he risk the ire of de jacue?

Lost souls ehh? I am like an iron lion in Zion my friend.

Underpaid by Tim, are you a hebe ol Timeteo? But overpaid by God. Never pity anyone who may make more money in a year than you will in your life, has 11 kids and homes across the world plus some of the best lovers on the planet. If this soul is lost, there is a line to get in this club baby.

So Shizam the Haran, what makes you fit to judge El V besides your whole total of nine "got nothin to say but brown nose" posts that is.

Guys like you want to eat the cake but sure do not want to help bake it.

Lets hear it Pud Water, if you can post a snide comment, back it up with some substance or you will be cast down with loserboy and the Sodomites.

Something original now, or if you cannot do original, how about regurgitated.

Maybe a piss n vinegar enema will help to debase your impacted brain/colon.

“Wu Wei literally means "without doing" or "without causing."

It is a fundamental idea of philosophical Daoism. The idea is that non-interference in the natural flow of events results in harmonious relationships between entities within events.

The concept is most often symbolized by "pu" (the uncarved block). Using things according to their natural design will always yield the most efficient outcome, without struggling against the intrinsic nature of any thing. “

Basic encyclopedia stuff...

"Wei Wu Wei" is "to do without doing" or to "accomplish without effort." It was an extension of the the Wu Wei theory emphasized by Zhuang Zi and refers to the application of the principle of Wu Wei to achieve results by flowing with the nature of events. Everyone is floating down the same river. Some try to row against the current and squander their energy to no avail. Others actually "do nothing" and float where the river takes them in a helpless state. The few that understand Wei Wu Wei also go with the natural current, but they understand how to steer the boat.”

That brings nothing new to the table…

What I said corresponds to your technical definition, however, I put it in a practical way, one that can be used daily. Wu Wei and Wei Wu Wei are about physical calm and mental calm.

Both are applicable to fighting (and competing) and not fighting (peace) and not competing (cooperating). They represent the martial and the social.

So they have mutual benefit on and off the mat. Like ones entire kung fu education, if it is a complete one (that is more than physical protection techniques).

So Wei Wu Wei is non-interference, that is not using your physical body to disrupt what is natural.

It is using your mind to instruct your body not to do - not to act. This is done by exercising emotional control without physical movement.


Wu Wei is using your body, exercising physical control without mental movement. This is frequently used by those who are highly skilled and participating towards completing their 30 years of educational application of their kung fu knowledge to the real world (the one outside the martial arts studio, the “big” mat) to become a master strategist.

Wu Wei is also referred to as being synchronized or synergized with the Tao.

When you perform a technique on the little or big mat and you yourself have no idea, no memory of your movements, you have experienced Wu Wei.

Many times during intense top belt workouts in El Monte either I or my highly skilled co-practitioners would ask a question such as "Wow, I liked that technique, can you teach it to me?” And the other would respond, “Well, I do not remember what I did, but if you can show me what I did, maybe I can remember.” – in the moment, movement without thought, Wu Wei.

This is also crucial to peak performance. I am a Wu Wei junkie. I place my self in situation where nothing but Wu Wei is acceptable. Peak states.

Surfers often experience this in big wave surfing.

Wu Wei can also be experienced when you are so ingrained with the moment that when you finally look up, hours have passed that seems like minutes.

So the above are answers to how Wu Wei and Wei Wu Wei apply to both the martial and social world.

Thus endeth lesson.

Thanks Jack for all you enlightenment and wisdom. You are welcome Shane.

What sayeth you Captin Cartmell?

Oh yeah, how come Shamey always gets to sweep the mat and I don’t. Whaaaaa!



"Thanks for keeping an eye on Shane."

That deserved over time pay - you owe me big Cartmell.