Movement/Body Discipline

Tim's Discussion Board: Concepts : Movement/Body Discipline
   By Kit Leblanc on Wednesday, February 14, 2007 - 01:20 am: Edit Post

Let's continue with the training parameters for real confrontations laid out earlier.

The area of movement and body discipline is where training in the martial arts probably has its most applicable aspects to a street-oriented system. Problem is, it can have its most deleterious effects here as well depending on how you train.

It should be no surprise that whatever you train, it should allow you to move between relaxation and sudden explosive power. These two go hand in hand, especially during a real encounter that lasts more than a few moments. And some do.

I often read of martial artists feeling that because "real fights" don't last very long, they don't need to have at least basic conditioning. This is a huge mistake.

15-30 Seconds

Don't know where these stats come from but they were presented by a national trainer and court certified use of force expert.

While statistics are really more generalizations, I do believe that these stats are important because they are demonstrative of a real concern when facing "combat application."

The "average" officer, when engaged in fighting with full muscular exertion for 15-30 seconds, will probably need at least a 15 minute rest, but be capable of going back out and finishing the shift.

If the "average" officer has a similar combat for up to around a minutes time (60 seconds), that officer will generally be so fatigued and probably injured so as to require the rest of the shift, and perhaps another shift or two off, to recover.

Of the "average" officers that engage in a serious physical combat at full muscular exertion for over 60 seconds, 50% WILL MEDICALLY RETIRE DUE TO THEIR INJURIES.


The average officer *is* the average martial arts student in an art that does not do heavy conditioning and/or force-on-force partner work (sparring, randori, etc.)

Being able to tap into relaxation is important in light of these factors. The big one that many martial artists simply gloss over is the effect of adrenalin dump during a "real life" encounter. The effect occurs long before any physical contact is made. It is only made worse by the presence of multiples, weapons, etc.

Basically, its the uncertainty. It takes a while to get used to processing adrenalin dump, in order to mitigate its effects and stay relatively relaxed and use your "art" to any extent under real fight conditions. That is, facing real potentially violent and violent confrontations until the fear response becomes more like a "buzz." Few people in our society will ever get to that point, most of them are bouncers, cops, and the like - the experience of dealing with interpersonal aggression allows you to process it better, and stay more relaxed with increased exposure.

And as I am sure Jake has seen in his bouncing, many folks even in those professions are so uncomfortable and unskilled in handling physical confrontation that they never get used to it, and freak out or over react during potential physical encounters. There are the cops who scream on the radio to the point that you can't even understand them when they get the adrenalin dump, and that's for even the folks running AWAY from them and not even presenting an actual physical threat.

A caveat to this goes back to awareness. If you get blindsided, hit with something you didn't expect or that otherwise caused a fear reaction, that'll get the ol' juice flowing again. That is where awareness works hand in hand with your physical body. When the old masters said "mind and body as one," they knew what they were talking about. Most of 'em fought for real a lot, though, usually when armed, so they understood this aspect in a very different way than someone who never did that, but thinks they are "doing the same thing the masters did," does.

You'll always get some juice. This is good as it makes you sharper. But, your relaxation has to be functional with it, and your technique has to be honed with it.

What do I mean?

Simply this - beware of excessively stylistic fighting methods - very low stances, mimicking the animal "form" versus the animal "intent," long pauses or odd flourishes, or really doing anything that is not a natural movement. Constant repetitive exercises of involved patterns, partner patterns, are also in this category.

You see time and again martial artists who don't actually fight, when they go against people in a real fight - the martial art they study goes right out the window, and is replaced with what appears to be an instinctive method of bad boxing/kickboxing and grappling. The early UFCs were great for this - trained guys simply threw out their chosen systems and resorted to flailing and tussling that pretty much only works against people who know nothing, or who rely on the same type of fighting.

We see the exact same thing in police training when we use training ammunition fired from real guns, that hurts when it hits, and put it in the hands of bad guys who are not cooperating - the folks that only shoot on the range, and don't actually "gunfight" in training often throw their trained skills out the window. They tend to do stuff they have never trained, because stress simply overrode their non-stress training and they defaulted to an untrained response. Highly trained people do this. So its not just that you are trained, its HOW you are training.

Why do some people keep their style, and others don't?

The folks that keep it train under similar stress dynamics. The more the better. The stress of another person fighting back and countering their efforts - trying to "beat" them, as it were. In the tactical training community we call it "stress inoculation."

One of the best methods for stress inoculation, believe it or not (many seem almost religiouly bound not to...), is competition. I don't compete a lot, but the pace and aggression of an actual competitive bout, with the performance pressure and lots of people watching, adds up to a great shot of stress inoculation similar to the real thing. Indeed, I have been in a number of real confrontations that were far less stressful than competition.

So, the best way to get ahead of the adrenalin curve is to train in natural movements that allow you to maintain a relative relaxation, are efficient, sound "human" fighting movement versus the aping of a stylistic ideal, and to practice these same movements under increasing pressure of greater and greater resistance and uncertainty as to what an opponent can do.

I do believe that the internal Chinese MA offer benefits here over some other styles because they tend to focus on posture and movement that is natural and similar to the same way you would move in a fight.

Look at your training: if it doesn't look like a fight, it ain't going to come out in a fight. Take boxing: boxing's shadow boxing looks like the guy is....boxing. He does not suddenly revert to a completely different movement pattern or technical flourishes that don't appear when he actually fights. When you practice solo shots in wrestling, or throws in judo, you do them exactly the way you would in a live wrestling session.

Doing things differently is not training for fighting. It may be calisthenic, it may be artistic, it may have some benefit to overall movement or the establishment of a particular physical organization that your art relies upon, but it is not a fighting movement. This is why the "combat applications" sections of most martial arts books are pretty much worthless - the guy is doing his form, not fighting. It can work - but not against an attacker that poses a serious threat. I don't know about you, but I train for the folks that are a serious threat. The non-threats tend to get taken care of if you can handle that.

I believe that since the martial arts for the most part have ceased being the province of fighting men, the latter aspects have come to the fore and the vast majority of martial arts training is in the developmental exercises that have nothing to do with the actual fighting. You see many examples of this when the budding student asks the teacher which form he should work on for fighting and the teacher says "none of them - just work your straight punch and your kick and you'll have all you need." Shuai Jiao's "one year of shuai jiao is worth three years in other arts" saying goes to this as well.

It has a lot to do with what happens when you are under stress. And more importantly, it has to do with how you train to be more efficient and "artful" under stress.


   By Mark Kennedy on Friday, February 16, 2007 - 11:05 am: Edit Post

Very good points. have been in a good share of 'live' confrontations, but none since starting the arts. The adrenaline dump/learning to be calm while also aware are very real concerns--maybe the things that determine the outcome. Thanks.


   By Michael Taylor on Thursday, August 30, 2007 - 12:57 pm: Edit Post

I wouldn't knock form for training -- provided that one knows decent applications from the form so that they are essentially shadow-boxing & not merely dancing.

I also don't knock practical application (because it's a great teacher).

The old fighters mentioned above did it all: sparred, practiced their forms, conditioned their bodies, & fought: a well-rounded approach to training & application. They knew their form's/forms' purpose(s) so practicing such was of much martial benefit...

...practicing the movements of a form without understanding makes the moves seem meaningless & in some cases even like a needless flourish.

Granted that many folks practice form without understanding (as I raise my hand being guilty of this) & many end-up posturing needlessly out on the street -- but once a decent (not a BS) application or three is understood from each move within a form, then the form-practice becomes martial practice.

Under stress one will use what one's most comfortable with &/or whatever comes to mind at the moment.

Police-involved fights often last long when the officer tries not to harm the individual that he or she is trying to cuff. If one doesn't give a damn about what happens to the other guy & uses any means available to end a fight decisively, then one's fights will have a greater tendency to be short & brutal affairs.


   By Backarcher on Thursday, August 30, 2007 - 04:55 pm: Edit Post

great


   By William on Friday, August 31, 2007 - 12:19 pm: Edit Post

Michael,
I agree with that, training forms that are not the watered down versions we see in say modern wushu, but instead in those systems that have not been altered contain many fighting applications, forms are just a method to engrain those moves in the muscle memory, the next step is to extract those application and train them in sparring with a non cooperative partner.


   By Kit Leblanc on Saturday, September 08, 2007 - 11:01 pm: Edit Post

"Police-involved fights often last long when the officer tries not to harm the individual that he or she is trying to cuff. If one doesn't give a damn about what happens to the other guy & uses any means available to end a fight decisively, then one's fights will have a greater tendency to be short & brutal affairs."

A point frequently brought up, and one which highlights a common misunderstanding many martial artists have re: police use of force, and their own use of same.

You do not, by any means, have carte blanche to do whatever you think is necessary against any and every perceived threat out there.

Officers are not bound "not to harm" an individual they are trying to arrest. Instead, they are bound by the level of resistance that the suspect presents. In the vast majority of incidents this means no resistance. Past that, most represent little resistance - trying to tighten up when the cuffs are slapped on, or trying to pull away.

An officer is justified in using a reasonably greater level of force in these instances based on the level of resistance the suspect presents. For low level, this means usually a takedown. If an officer is justified in taking you down, does so, and you happen to break your nose as it hits the pavement, if the use of force was justified, the injury is justified.

Most officers are experienced enough, or have enough backup, to avoid this stuff routinely, but it does happen.

As a citizen, you are bound by essentially the same standard. In using physical force, you can only respond in most circumstances with force on equal to that of the level of threat (against someone physically assaulting you) or resistance (say making a citizen's arrest on a shoplifter) that you are met with. Go beyond this, in other words "don't give a damn about what happens to the other guy, and use any means available to end a fight decisively" and you are asking for a felony conviction.

In many jurisdictions, there is a greater burden on the citizen than the officer, as citizens will frequently have a "duty to retreat."

Now, when you get to threats that involve serious bodily injury or death, then both the officer and the non-sworn citizen are perfectly justifiable in not giving a damn about the other guy and using anything they can to end a fight decisively. Hopefully with enough skill to make the fight a "short and brutal affair."

A police officer does not give up his right to self defense just because he is an officer. He has the same freedom that any citizen does when he reasonably and justifiably feels his life is in danger. Just as the citizen has the same expectation of only going as far as necessary in what should be reasonably perceived to be low level threats.

But against this level of threat we also come to a second great misunderstanding, and that is that the martial artist tends to think of his "attacker" as he thinks of the relatively sedentary, middle class blue or white collar worker, often with little athletic background, against whom he is working his "deadly killing forms honed over centuries on the battlefields of Asia."

It don't work that way.

Most attackers will in fact be a far cry from the relatively innocuous practitioners that populate US martial arts dojo. Unless it is simply a drunken brawl with some frat boy at the local bar, or the uncle that had too much at the wedding (in which case anything other than restraint is far from justified). Instead, expect serious fights to involve people heavily intoxicated on alcohol and/or drugs. And if its meth they are on, you can throw your ideas about what "works" to restrain people, and on what tactics you have to make the fight a "short and brutal affair," out the window.


   By robert on Saturday, September 29, 2007 - 07:31 pm: Edit Post

hey, i heaaaaard that, dont ever fight a tweaker, it takes about 5 times more effort.lol

one thing, you forgot about breathing...

and i still think forms are a great way to train.

and just a side note, ive seen on that show cops, drunk guys and crackheads getting judo slammed and its pretty sad, they even off balance people and do like group throws, which i suppose is necessary when trying to keep the peace, but you gotta admit, some cops just go over the line.

perhaps its because they cant handle the adrenalin?


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