Hey Tim, I'm sure you've seen the Kanji for aiki, as in aikido or aikijujutsu. How is that combination of charictors used in Chinese? Could you fill me in a bit, and give your translation of those charictors? In chinese are they ever used in relation to martial activitys, or are they ever used with common daily things?

Thanx
-Chris

"Ai" is pronounced "he" in Mandarin, it means to combine or unite into one entity. The word is also used in many combinations that denote cooperation. "Ki" of course is "qi."

Tim, what is the difference between "song" in chinese (I wish I could show the character, it's on page 63 in your "xing yi nei gong" book) and the Japanese word "ju"? they are different characters, but do they have similar meanings or no?

"Sung" is commonly translated as "relax," but the word in Chinese denotes a state between tense and flaccid.

The Japanese word "ju" is pronounced "rou" in Chinese and means "flexible" or "pliable."

The two words are often used in combination in Chinese (sung rou).

"Sung" is like a tree limb, or a spring, right? "rou" is like clay?

When you combine the words, what is the meaning?

sung rou denotes a kind of pliable flexibilty, like the quality inherent in young bamboo; enough plasticity to yield to force, with the ability to store the force and "snap" back to its original shape.

"Sung" is commonly translated as "relax," but the word in Chinese denotes a state between tense and flaccid."

Could this be the end of floppy Taiji? My teacher has been screaming this to the walls for years.

Tim, could you explain the difference between "Sung" and "peng", for me at least in practice/movement they seem to be the same to me. Is there a clear distinction or just another way of flogging a dead horse on correct principles.

Best,
Pete

Pete- do a 'search' (left side of screen) for "Peng".


You can even specify 'Posts by Tim' and you may save Tim some typing.

It's all about saving Tim's typing...

hehehehehehe

Thanks bro. I'll search and rephrase if I have any questions.

Hi Pete,

"Peng" in traditional Taijiquan parlance refers to any type of force that moves upward. Many people seem to use the term to denote a kind of whole body spring-like resilience. The latter definition is very close to the concept of "sung."

"Whole body spring-like resilience." Great stuff, Tim. What the does Ma Yuehliang mean when he describes pengjin as something like "the primary force upon which all others are based (my paraphrasing)?

Buddy,

I think Ma Yeuliang is referring to the same thing as the spring-like resilience definintion of peng.

Without correct alignment and balance between tension and relaxation, the body has no power (jing) to begin with, so this type of "primary force" is the foundation of all others.

dear tim,
since we're talking about aiki,i was wondering
why is all the aikido moves start with a wrist grab,and who the hell fight like that?
i like the priciples of circle and spirals about it.

Marc,

Well, I've never practiced Aikido, but I think many techniques start with a wrist grab so that the practitioner can get a feel of applying a technique against a more stationary opponent applying static force, before moving on to more dynamic attacks.

Maybe someone who has practiced Aikido would like to comment.

make sense tim,thanks.
but then they should also start from
different grab like body locks,2 on 1
or anything else!

I believe the reason that Aikido techniques focus around wrist grabs is because of it's inherited interest in weapons fighting. Aikido comes to us from traditional Samurai methods of combat. Samurais were a class dedicated to combat, specifically armed combat. If someone has a weapon, lets say a knife, and your reaction is to grab him in a bear hug, it is likely you will be stabbed, perhaps fatally. Common body locks are a great idea in unarmed combat, they give you the ability to control all of a persons body, however in armed combat it's the appendages that will hold weapons and can quickly cause damage. Along this line of logic, if I were to pull a knife on you, your best first bet is to try and control my hand because it’s holding the weapon. This idea is what I believe the majority of aikido's syllabus is focused around. If I have a weapon, and you attempt to grab my wrist and stop me from killing you, the techniques enlisted by aikidos syllabus will allow me to either quickly clear my hand, or to turn the grab against you, and gain the advantage. Also all the grabbing practice (as seen in many pre war styles) will help you in learning to securely hold someone's wrist in order to keep them from using a weapon on you. Many High level Aikidoka can control much of your body by only grabbing your wrist. In unarmed combat it's pretty foolish to devote your first attack to grabbing only a wrist, however if that wrist is connected to a hand with a knife, gun, or what have you, controlling that hand is crucial to your survival.

I also believe that this is the original reason for many of the submission holds seen in submission wrestling. For example the american lock from mount, in normal unarmed combat, I think if you have a good base (ability to stay on top) it's a better bet to stay upright (easier to see what's around you) and to simply pound down on your opponent with your fists. This ground and pound strategy is also effective in competitive mixed martial arts competition because it can deliver a lot of damage without taking as many risks of compromising your position. However, if you are mounted atop a man with a weapon in his hand, he is still terribly dangerous, even though you have the positional advantage ( a huge advantage if he's empty handed) his weapon sways the advantage back to him and he can still kill you. Simply pounding down on him is a very bad idea (he will simply stab you in return doing more damage to you then you can do to him), it is a better idea to take his wrist, isolate it from his other hand, and if possible brake his arm-making it harder for him to use his weapon. This same strategy applies well with other upper body submissions like: arm bar, americana, kimura etc.

I believe most modern practitioners of Aikido are missing it's core advantages, and focusing there efforts in the wrong places. The techniques of Aikido were simply not designed for unarmed combat. Also I think Aikidoka need to have noncompetitive sparring and free resistance added to their training.

-Chris Hein

you dell'em thrith!

but the moves are done with the opponent grabing
your wrist first.
i get what you mean about the weapon thing
and i agree.
but they grab your wrist as a attack??
or when you see the so called master
fighting many attackers,they all come running
at him with stupid unrealistic punches or chops.
who the hell use chops anyway?
and then,they're all sent flying in the air
and land in tumble.
if you ever wrestled you know poeple don't just
go fly in the air like that so easy.
maybe it's just that my skill are not at that level.
but i've slammed a few aiki dudes on the mat before,and i've never been send flying in tumbles
neither!maybe it's because i didn't grab there
wrists.

It's probably true because most Aikido people can't fight. The tumbling happens because Aikido people like to look fancy.

They grab your wrist. The Idea is if I'm a Samurai, I like to be able to slaughter unarmed people as efficiently as possible, so I train for if they grab my wrist. If I have a knife and you grab my wrist there is a slight possibility that you will stop me from cutting you up, so I must know how to either clear my hand (by moving in a way that you cannot hold me, or in a way that hurts your wrist so you want to let go) or I must be able to move in a way that if you continue to hold me you will lose your balance or brake something. The wrist grab as an actual attack was actually a bit of a bad explanation on my part, I should have said counter, it's not really an attack, but a means of stopping an attack.

That taking on multiple attackers is also in my opinion only something done when armed, it's near impossible to fight more then one person (even if your are greatly skilled) unless you are armed. There again is the matter of efficiency with your weapon, if I'm fighting 3 guys with a knife, and one of the guys can hold my knife hand for just a short amount of time it will enable his friends to get me, thus I must be efficient at clearing my hand.

I think those unrealistic chops and punches look stupid because Aikido guys don't know what they are a representation of. I think they are suppose to represent stabs and slashes, however people who have never been in a fight are keen on karate chops and lunging punches.

-Chris Hein

How's the creation of modern Gekken going along Chris?