>Either you fight or you don't. I thought this
>was martial arts. 'Oh, we only cross our legs
>and rub our chi and F*$#in' TALK about fighting.

It depends on what you mean with fighting or whether you think that sparring and fighting is the same. But I do not think that your generalizations are appropriate.

>If you think I'm one of Cartmell's cult
>followers, think again.

I do not know who you are and I do not care about it, but I am interested in what kind of cult Tim Cartmell has.

Hi Mark,
you wrote:

I was a little hesitant on what I saw in
the videos until he demonstrated some fast elbow
patterns, it established his credentials for me.

Could you explain what you were hesitant about and why the elbow patterns changed your mind. did you meet with park bok nam in person?

thanks for the replies

Fighting is DIFFERENT than sparring - idiot.
How about it, you Sheila, why not fight. THAT's the bottom line. The unltimate test. 'Oh, just friendly sparring." Pussy! Why not? Got some ethical thing against it? Then take up Yoga, putz boy! You don't belong in Martial arts. "I take martial arts to help me learn about myself..." -Yeah, right. Admit it, you're a wanna be tough guy that doesn't have the balls to do NHB or box but want's to 'play' fight. F#$% you!

I don't know what type of cult Cartmell has, but if tells me I can F#$% some blond S. Californian hottie, if I join - I'm joining. You're a F*&#$in' internal Kung Fu clown anonymous!

"There's only one Betty, The now wanna be cult member Betty that does Californian hotties, BIG BALLED BETTY!!!"

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Does that mean that I have to disable my browser cache every time I visit this site?

>Admit it, you're a wanna be tough guy that
>doesn't have the balls to do NHB or box but
>want's to 'play' fight.

I do not want to be a tough guy, there's no reason to be one. Btw I have not heard anything about Tim taking part in an such an event, but maybe I am just uninformed.

>How about it, you Sheila, why not fight. THAT's
>the bottom line. The unltimate test. 'Oh, just
>friendly sparring." Pussy! Why not?

Simply because I can not speak for John Adams. I have just read that he is open to anyone who thinks that Jiulong Ba Gua Zhang is fake. If you want to know exactly what he means with his statement you have to ask him. It's just that simple.

>You're a F*&#$in' internal Kung Fu clown >anonymous!

Have I ever stated that I am doing an "internal" martial art?

hey anon..n ..n ..n

cult is quite close to the word which describes you .. stop giving anon's a bad name


anon no 2

For Henry Lee I have not met Park nor any of his students. In the videos sometimes he shifted his feet which made me wonder if his position wasn't right and he was adjusting. This made me wary. Nothing he demonstrates is of the 'flashy' variety and might be faked by someone who had only a moderate level of skill, just enough to move smoothly. (Remember also, that someone with a high level of skill may move so smoothly that what they do may appear not to be difficult). The videos have a few attack/response demos where he moves pretty quick. The elbow drills were shown first slow then fast, the skill he demonstrated could not have not have been faked.

Further: He didn't write the books, one of his students did. He clearly states that if someone is doing something different, even radically so, if they have a good reason, and it works, then fine. The method he presents breaks down and presents basic movements better than I had ever seen before. He constantly emphasizes how most people try to practice Pa Kua at 'f' or 'm' when they haven't developed 'a,b, and c' and may not even know them. He is especially strong on principles and concepts, that if these are not thoroughly understood then the student really knows nothing.

Anonymous;
You actually read something I posted ! WOW ! Nobody does that. I actually started falling asleep reading that page. You must be a lawyer (Rechtsanwälte?) to go over that page with a fine toothcomb and seem to enjoy it.

P.S. Clear that CACHE !

Yo Betty - What's your freakin' problem? You don't believe in chi? And now you think you're "all that" because you finally found out that the Great One is running a cult here in So Cal...

Let me clue you in - CHI IS REAL!!! And the reason we've formed a cult is to keep the truth away from "real fighters" who would use it to kill children and dogs, and to deflower virtuous women. It's our duty.

We members of the Cult of Cartmell / Southern California (we call ourselves COCs for short) have in our posession ancient manuscripts that describe, in detail, how you can train a 230 lb. man to fly in less than 5 minutes.

By relating the ancient texts to the eight trigrams, we were able to use the five elements to construct the necessary training apparatus. From metal, we formed the "heaven rod" that would interface with the dan tien. From earth, we took potash and carbon to formulate the forbidden "chi powder". The texts say "when fire between heaven and earth is free, hidden dragon rises". The problem was that the Great One didn't do a particularly good job in translating just how we should conjur up lightening on demand (we've since figured out how to do that, too), so we had to settle for a 12v battery, two pieces of wire, and a contact switch...

Shame on you, Big Balled Beanbag, for not believing. I took a relatively untrained civilian (my neighbor Pablo) and gave him 3 minutes instruction in horse stance meditation so he could focus his chi, then spent another 2 minutes showing him how to stand in the San Ti position. That was all it took...

The rest was simple! After I was sure Pablo could focus his chi and stand in the fighting stance, we followed the manuscript's instructions for chi flight. The sequence goes like this:

1.) "Metal and Earth are One" - This means stuff as much of the forbidden chi powder as you can into the "heaven rod".

2.) "Metal, Earth, and Fire Can Meet on Dark Side of Moon" - Loosely translated, this means when the small black button (attached to the battery and heaven rod with wires)is pressed, the elements combine to make chi. So, I hooked everything up, just like the manuscripts said.

3.) "Spread Cheeks to Find Heaven" - To work properly, the heaven rod has to be positioned as closely to the dan tien as possible. Therefore, I inserted the heaven rod in Pablo's anus to the point it stopped at the gateway.

The rest is history:

T-5 Pablo meditates in the horse stance

T-4 When he centered his Chi, he assumed San Ti

T-3 When entering San Ti, he lifted his anus so the chi could flow upward

T-2 I sensed the change in his aura

T-1 Heaven, Earth, and Fire met on the dark side of the moon

T-0 According to our sun compass and abacus calclations, Pablo rose vertically to a height of 19 feet, 7 inches, thus proving our advanced chi theories.

Let this be a lesson to all you bad boys out there (you, too BBB) who like to mess with COCs. If we can teach an overweight real estate agent to fly in 5 minutes, just imagine how devasting our fighting skills are. We are invincible!

And remember, don't bother to physically train. It is a WASTE OF TIME! Because we practice the true internal arts (yes, that includes chi), we know that fighting ability is "all in your head"

C'ao, yall

Okay FunDong,
You convinced me. I like the idea of unleashing the freakin' dragon between my legs when experiencing on of the COC's S. Califorian hotties.

Sign me up.

"There's only one Betty, BIG BALLED BETTY!"

p.s. Hey SysOp - Don't let someone reading you mundane sh*t go to your big head.

Come on over! We've got PLENTY to go around!

Henry Lee Back to Erle M. again for a monent. It might be useful to you to check out his website and spend some time going through the articles. It is huge, several hundred pages of articles, short books, Q&A, technique, health, etc. The site is what convinced me to buy his videos, it made me want to see more. It seemed open and honest but particulary did not simply say 'Buy my stuff and I'll tell you about...'. His site puts it all right on the line. He puts enought material out on the site for several complete books. I have printed out hundreds of pages of info of what he puts out for free (no exageration).

On our host, Tim, I first heard of him on Luos' tapes and now have one of his tapes, expect to be getting another one, on standing.

OOh OOh !!! I love cults!!!!
I wanted to start one here in the midwest but there just arent enough loonie toonies!! can I join Tims cult???? I can speak a little Chinese! I've studied some ba gua and Tai Chi!!! OOh Ooh wait till I tell my friends I am in a cult!!!
Dead

Hey Betty,
judging from the new map of Tim's school, you should be able to find plenty of "trailer park hotties" to suit your unique taste and style if you ever visit!!

Mark,

you are right, Erle M's site is very extensive and loaded with all sorts of info. However, after viewing him on 2 of his tapes, I would not put too much stock in what he is teaching. Only speaking for myself here, not suggesting that you shouldn't either. I saw his tape on Dim Mak and on bagwa and he really has no clue what he is talking about in my opinion.

Deadpool,
Of course you can join my cult! Just send me your life savings, and I'll send you a pair of our official cult sport shoes, a booklet on how to stockpile weapons and some 'special' Kool Aid.
Tell your friends!

SysOp:

Tim's advertising his cult here and hasn't been pre-approved! Damn it don't your guidelines, rules, regulations and decrees mean anything?

I really don't want to discuss that topic in this public forum. Contact me offline and we can meet at the ashram and discuss it over a nice cool glass of Kool-Aid.

OOOOHHH I love kool aid!!!
And special shoes!! man you cant go wrong with Tims cult!!But I am afraid my life savings is probably a little disappointing. Maybe I could be a junior member?? with one cool shoe and half the Kool-Aid!!
Yaay!! come on kids!! OHYEAH!!! ( As the big red walking pitcher, happy smile and all, busts through the wall behind me!!!)

Henry Lee Are there specific items which made you leary of Montaigue? While there are a number of people who are critical of Erle M., I have seen only one who offered a specific comment. That was critical of Erles method of fa ching where in the execution the heels may rise up or the feet may even leave the ground. I know that there are times I see something which sets off my b.s. sensors but not necessarily something I can put my finger on. Erles approach in presenting forms is to show a 'simple' verson then add detail later(not completly sure I agree with this method)