I used to stand a lot when studying ba gua but stopped after a while to focus on other types of conditioning like lifting more weights. The main benefit that I derived from it was being more rooted when doing compliant drills like push hands. All the standing I did didn't prepare me to get my dropped on my head by experienced wrestlers which is when I stopped to focus more on getting stronger.

Recently I was injured when I got thrown. I was thrown and my ankle rolled inward(typical ankle sprain position) but then I fell on it with my body weight and heard a pop or maybe a snap. I was told that I might have torn the ligaments in my ankle which sucks since the only typical treatment is surgery which I refuse to do. Chinese medicine has some modalities to deal with this that are less invasive.

Because of this I've started doing zhan zhaung starting with the hsing i san ti stance in particular. These postures are good for realigning bones and strengthening the surrounding muscles. This will be my main form of physical therapy as I need to keep from rolling my ankle inward again while the ligaments "heal".

I did standing before wrestling and saw little benefit once I started. I'm excited to see if standing training is of benefit after doing more wrestling and this injury has forced me to test this out for myself.

Has anyone else found ba gua/hsing i stance keeping to be of benefit in their wrestling against bigger people? Also has anyone torn ligaments in their ankle before and successfully returned to training without surgery?

Standing has helped every aspect of my martial art practice, sparring included. I'm a smaller person weighing in at around 130lb and I can see/feel the results of standing while wrestling with bigger people. I can keep good posture better under stress, I feel it makes it harder for people to break my posture, I can use full body power more efficiently, my mental focus seems sharper etc... I do a lot of other practices too, but standing is a regular one. I can feel the difference in my game when I haven't practiced standing for a while.

Nice. What style of wrestling do you do?

Stuff from CMA and Judo.

Timothy,

In my experience most ankle injuries (unless very severe) will heal up well over time. I suggest you ice the injured area after any kind of training, buy a lace up ankle brace with side supports, and if you can, get some physical therapy, it will most likely cut down on your healing time and strengthen the ankle so it's less likely to be re-injured.

Thanks for the advice, Tim. I've sprain my ankle 12+ times combined over my life. While it's true a minor sprain will heal a major one stretches the ligaments leaving the ankle joint unstable(which is how I've sprain it so many times). This was a pretty major sprain since there was a pop as well.

I'd recommend that anyone avoid ice as it freezes the dead blood. Ice does bring down swelling initially but as I said freezes the old blood. This causes a problem because the new blood can't get in to do the healing so ice hurts injury recovery in the long run. I'd also recommend that you guys seek out someone who does joint manipulations whether it is a chiropractor, osteopath(not an orthopedist), or a TCM practitioner who does traditional Chinese bone setting(like Hsu Hong Ji). This people will realign the bones so rehab can begin on a stable joint. This is the path I have taken with all injuries over the last few years with great success.

I did the rest, ice, compression, and elevation stuff for my first ankle sprain 15 years ago and when I dislocated my elbow 6 years ago. The results? My ankle hurt for 2 years after the injury where shooting pain went up and down my foot. I continued icing it with no result. It ended up being unstable and weak and was sprained repeatedly over the years. The elbow become chronically in pain and I couldn't straighten it. You know what the docs told me? Ice it and take it easy for two weeks and if it still hurts we'll give you a cortisone shot.

Anyway, I stopped listening to the biowestern model of injury treatment because it doesn't work. Get the sweeping down by using Chinese herbs, get a joint manipulation to realign the joint, and begin doing exercise to rehab the injury as soon as possible. For severe injuries take as much time off from your sport to heal. That's my advice.

The reason I'm doing San ti/stance keeping is because it stabilizes the ankle allowing the bones to become stronger in their natural alignment. This is the way I'm using ti strengthen the ligaments which hopefully aren't torn.

applying ice to your ankle for a little while can freeze old blood? Why doesn't my coke freeze when I put ice in it? (my body temp is much warmer than the coke was when I applied the ice.... must be the caffine.)

for your elbow, take 4 advil 3 times a day for a week (that'll help your ankle too). That will be perscription strength ibuprophan and will take down the swelling allowing your unfrozen bloodcells to do their work.

It sounds like you're a chronic spaigner... western and eastern treatments have failed you.

(I think Tim's suggestion of physical therapy involves finding someone who can do joint manipulation)

I didn't literally mean frozen like the blood is ice.

Ice tends to make the blood from the broken blood vessels get stuck and makes it harder for your body to move it out. Lol

I was a chronic sprainer before learning about eastern medicine. A chronic injury is hard for any modality to treat whether easter or western. The way to keep them from getting chronic is by going the eastern approach imo.

Biomedicine has a ton of good ways to diagnose injury but lack the tools for effective treatment. I'm all for getting the x-rays, mri, etc initially to see what's wrong.

Hsu Hong Ji had Said something once that I read in a book. He was treating someone's injury and another person asked if he should get some ice. Hsu said, "Why? He's not dead?". As in ice is to preserve not to heal. It's worth thinking about if you are a proathlete who can't afford to be sidelined and who does not want to get addicted to pain medication. If you only play soccer once a week recreationally then ice away while sitting at yor work desk for the next month. But if you're David Beckam you'd better look into alternative ways of treatment.

According to the Sports Medicine website, icing an acute injury as soon as possible is one of the best things you can do to reduce inflammation and speed up the healing process.

Quote: "Cold therapy with ice is the best immediate treatment for acute injuries because it reduces swelling and pain. Ice is a vaso-constrictor (it causes the blood vessels to narrow) and it limits internal bleeding at the injury site."

Ice alsO causes muscles and tendons to constrict which just makes for the healing time to take longer. Of course the sports medicine site says that. I went to a foot speciAlist and he told me the same exact thing. He also told me my foot wasn't broken(I already knew that). All this means is a lack of knowledge overall on injury rehabilitation. The fact that an orthopedist, podiatrist, sports website all say the same thing means one of two things: that this dogma is the pinnacle of sports medicine and everyone bow before it or that the knowledge is limited over the whole biomedicine spectrum. I'm not going to go on a crusade here. I'm not even advocating anyone go to an acupuncturist. All I'm saying is see if you are still in pain or stiff 2-3 months after the injury. You shouldn't be if it was treated properly initially.

Some injuries last a long time, some never go away. It may not be due to the rehab, but to the type of injury and other activities outside of rehab.

Icing helps stop hematoma and swelling. After 24 hours of icing I go to heat treatment, but always cold right after injury. It's worked just fine for me.

Stance training will not do anything for you technique wise. Its good for strength and power building but what is going to help you fight a bigger opponent is more likely dynamic movement, sticking/following, timing, and leg techniques.

Good luck with training, hope you get better soon

Thanks, Robert. I'm 85% healed. I agree with your points and those things are definitely easier to do when you are strong enough in relation to the opponent.