I have been watching the Lion dvds by Xie Peiqi and it seems that all but one strike (a drop) involve moving the hips/pelvis forward then thrusting them to the rear with the strike. Is anyone familiar with this?

I am unfamiliar with this form, but I do have a question for the folks who do roam here.
about ten years ago i was given some very basic instruction in a stationary form of chi gung which quickly (within 30 days) alterd most of my world for the better and gave some surprising and potentially dangerous tools to attempt to manage during all waking hours. now ten years later, I feel the pull of the practice, and I want very much to have the clarity that I knew then, however, (please forgive the running on) in recalling some of the less glamourous side effects I have turned to the web for information.
if you have experiance with an internal form of meditation that does not offer to bruise yer friends when you aren't looking please let me know. thanks and yes i'd be glad to give a more thorough explanation, just get a message to my email pilgrim36@yahoo.com

Mark

The Five Forces of Yin Style Bagua
(The word Li means Force)

I. Ni Li ( Opposing, Moving against )- This force generates a scissors like effect when the upper and lower body oppose each other stretching and twisting the major muscles and tissues of the torso. The power arrives when the body snaps back into its natural state. This force is circular and on a relatively horizontal plane.

II. Shun Li ( Unifying, Moving with )- This force generates a whole-body power when all the separate parts are moving in unity and in the same direction. The shoulders, waist, and hips will all be in time and in perfect unison. This force is also circular and on a relatively horizontal plane.

III. Han Li ( Concaving, Containing )- This force is circular but on a relatively vertical plane, its done through the lengthening and contracting ability of the spine/torso, legs, and arms. In a simplified explanation imagine standing tall and stretching up the body, then lock your shoulder and arm joints and concave the chest while dropping your weight and bending your knees. You are chopping down with the arm but using the weight of the your body and the muscles of the torso to generate the power rather than just using the strength of the shoulder joint.

IV. Ting Li ( Straight, Driving )- This force is generated from the the bottom of the spine where it connects with the pelvis and moves outward in any direction in a relatively horizontal plane. The power comes from the connection between the hand and the lower spine, any line of force can be traced back through the arm to the lower spine. The feet and legs are rooted and the arm and back are connected essentially the body is held immovable, anything pushing against the hand would have to push the whole body across the ground and anything hit by the hand would be hit by the whole body. This force and the one above are common to movements found in Xing Yi.

V. Deng Li ( Spiraling, Popping )- This force comes from the legs and their connection to the ground, it can be in a circular or straight manner and usually on a diagonal plane. The power comes from the foot, spiraling or corkscrewing upward through the legs, hips, torso, and finally through the arms. It can also be done by using the hinge joint power of the leg and sending a straight abrupt wavelike force through the body. Either way the power comes from the ground up and upon meeting resistance it traces the same route back to the ground. Again using the entire weight of the body.

As you may have noticed the Five Forces are all different ways of utilizing the whole body to generate power, and I believe it covers most of the ways that a human body could accomplish it, especially considering the overlapping of the different forces. Learning and understanding the Five forces and their differences is crucial to understanding Yin Style Bagua and being able to progress through the system and apply power in the movements.


this is taken from yinstylebagua.com

The lion strikes are usually taught in threes at first.
3 sweeping , 3 smashing , 3 chopping, 3 hooking 3 blocking, 3 seizing 3 grasping and 3 shocking.

Usually there is an outward strike an inward strike and a dropping strike which may go in or out
The outward sweeping strike may be considered as using Shun Li or unifying force as the hand and foot go in same direction
The inward sweeping strike may be considered as using ni li or opposing force as the hand and foot go in opposite directions
This is more apparent in the stepping drills not the stationary ones.

Hope this helps.

The next day...

Got your request to explain a bit more, here goes.
In '93 i was attending a massage therapy school in Omaha, Nebraska. met a fellow who'd been practicing kung fu for several years as well as many varied other styles. I expressed an intrest in meditation during one of our conversations and the idea of chi gung was dropped into my life. My instructions came in the form of a few sheet of stationary on which had been carefully written out what time of day/night, for how long, what to expect, what are some common experiences, and a verbal dicussion of what the dan tien will feel like when it is sufficiently well supplied to begin circulating the chi, not to mention how to navigate through the initial circulation(pucker this, relax that... you know the drill). So I begin on this mystic road, mind full of how I will utilize this extra energy for the benefit of those in my care. the first few days brought subtle changes. I began to wake up at 6am, no discussion, no possibility of going back to sleep, really more accurately no need. if i went to bed at a normal hour I got up at 6. if I went to sleep at 4am, i would wake at 6am. fully rested. i didn't try to push for the limits on that one so, lets assume it to be a bad idea to continuously lay down at 4 only to get up again 2 hours later. Forgive my candor, my bowell movement got regular enough to set a watch by. after a few more days I began to be unable to eat/drink anything of a less than wholesome nature, cool! as well, the clarity of my mind began to get somewhat spectacular. aside from being able to know what was about to happen, there was the childish ability to influence outcomes. card games were easy enough to win. again, childish and not the point of the exercises. after two and a half weeks of daily meditation/breathing things began to get strange. I like to assume that i was not prepared for the level of interconectedness (that we all share but tend to ignore, as if not having a thing to do with anything else is a good idea) that became apparant, and the tiny things that send mountains to the bottom of the sea became more and more common and less friendly. I stopped the breathing exercises after 3 and one half weeks, after leaving a quarter sized bruise on a friends hand from only brushing it with my fingertips. this is also where the scary type stuff came in, lights flickering, images, "sillhouettes" of people coming an going ("like moths to a flame") being pushed about by an invisible "master", i only refer to him as such because of his deadly accurate nature and his (although silent)demands to hold strange positions for extended periods of time. got a bit hard for me to bear. so here i am 10 or so years later looking for a style that offers the benefits i am familiar with yet avoids the obnoxious spectors and physical damage to friends. I left out parts regarding pain erasure in others, dream cycles, communion with the non bodied, and some rather disturbing events that took place in colorado some years later but again, after i had begun a different sort of meditation. now, if you can point me toward a beneficial style please do. for the record, no. none of this is horseshit, I am not a liar and I certainly would not be trying to pull of some hoo-haw crapola only to laugh at those who would seriously show an interest in developing their innate ability.
care to share?
chris schwartz
Sitka,Ak

Hi Chris,

I would look at Bruce Kumar Frantzis' 'energy gates' nei-gung as it is a safe & very effective standing practise. Check out his 'Opening the energy gates of your body' book for more info. I have been practising for a couple of years now & it has worked wonders.

regards,
Mike

cshwartz,

To be quite frank with you, and I have experienced similar phenomena, your meditation opened you up to unclean spirits. What may seem "cool" to you, is really bad for you. You need to open up your Bible to Joel 2:32 and understand this verse and believe it in your heart. You need to then turn to Ephesians 6:13-18 and put on your spiritual armor (the Holy Spirit). More than likely you are under the influence of multiple spirits who are delighting in your quest for meditation (Mark 5:9). More than likely they will come back (Matthew 12:44). Pray to the Almighty Father in Jesus name and pray for the power of the Holy Spirit to deliver you from such influences. If you find yourself in desperate need I strongly advise you to find a pastor who is well versed on deliverance from unclean spirits. Your power over demons and anything in life is the Word of God (the Holy Bible) and prayer.

Martial arts has nothing to do with meditation and everything to do with the art of fighting (proper technique, body mechanics, conditioning, etc.). I have heard of Chinese Spirit Boxing before (this is also a bad idea).

For it is written . . . .

I'd like to thank you both for your responses.
number one, I will look into this standing form and see about its usefulness in my life.
number two, I do appreciate your message Ramone.
I was raised by my grand parents for most of my young life. My Grandfather, till his recent passing, was a Church of God minister lastly out of Anderson Indiana, my Grandmother is still physically with us and continues to be an inspiration daily. Thank you for your compassionate recomendations for the defense of my soul. I should state here that my intentions for this practice are not martial. simply put, the path I am on is one that inherently involves dealing with, or perhaps more accurately, dispatching things of a dark/unclean/diseased nature. now, for clarification, no I don't believe myself to be more than human. I don't expect to be anything remotely Christ like, nor do I expect anyone who does believe this to be in their right mind. however I am a human on this planet of wonders and dismay and I believe that to be human is more than just the process of feeding/excreting and reproducing. We are endowed with abilities far beyond those our western culture allows us to cultivate in public, I for one choose to embrace these potentials and try as one person can to let myself and those around me grow and become what we are, a manifestation of Gods love. Yeah, when I read it, it seems pretty intimidating but what else could we be here for?
thanks again,
chris

I can't find a book of Joel in my Bible... am I possessed or was I ripped off by that Bible salesman? (he only had one arm and spoke of spirits also)

Bob#2

In my sinful nature I would say you are an idiot (try between the books of Hosea and Amos). But the truth of the matter is that you are probably possessed, for no man in their right mind would blaspheme the Holy Spirit. Matthew 12:22-32/Mark 3:22-30.

Don't even get me started on the Torah. It's been downhill ever since the sacking of the second temple.

did I blaspheme the Holy Spirit? I didn't even mention the Holy Spirit... YOU"RE BEARING FALSE WITNESS!!! YOU'RE BEARING FALSE WITNESS and casting the first stone... you're just slappin' Yahew in the luminous face, buster.

I've got a suggestion for the guy who did Chi Gung for a few days and started communicating with spirits.... try Lithium.

You're not my neighbour and no stones have been cast. And in your hateful spite you blasphemed again.

The Greek word pharmakia, as the word was used and published in the original Bible, means drugs, and somehow the word was translated into the english as witchcraft or sorcery. Biblically, drugs are discouraged as a work of the flesh of man in opposition to the Spirit of God working in an individual. Based on my beliefs, it's just my opinion that psychotropic drugs would be counterproductive to the man engaged in qigong. Just my humble opinion, though.

Will you forgive me for angering you, Bob #2? My deepest apologies. Were you ever able to find the book of Joel?

Anybody care to get back on topic?

"Wave thy dollar, and see if she cometh to thy table." the Book of Kenny

All those creepy side effects of chigong, that's because you forgot to tuck your tail in.

If you don't tuck your tail and lift your anus, Satan would seep through your unsealed apertures and you'd be snatched and front-mounted by a Jealous God. If wouldn't have been such an unpleasant experience hadn't He been so beardy.

God is your imaginary friend and Chi power is his fantasy hand job

The Gospel of TCBob 99:108

I swear the All-Curmudgeon is real, and very very cranky.