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Patrick. It has been my experience that few Americans, particulary military, will learn more of a language than 'yes', 'no', and 'beer'. Those who go further often are concerned only with the odd American desire to swear in other tongues or to negociate with prostitutes.

People in other countries are usually amazed by any American who goes past that point, and any, even limited, ability to write in other characters further astounds them.

well i dont know about memoerizing the chinese alphabet •••• i can bearley write good now nah just kiddin i slang online sorry man hey but thank you for the good info i admire you guys hell one day maybe ill be a good teacher or a better student lata

Hey Qui,

I like the way you handled that troll! That took real guts son!

I hear you've got some kind of special breathing techniques that will make my muscles denser even faster than going to the gym or training. THAT'S AMAZING! Can you tell me exactly HOW DOES IT WORK? To think of all the time and money I wasted on professional trainers...

Boy, you REAL martial artists have it all figured out. Way to go Chinaman!

Hey Ken, I know you. You're that professional wrestle guy from the WWF. What happened to you?

Patrick, what Mark says about how foreigners view our attempts at speaking their language is spot on. And I don't think there are any chinese that know their whole alphabet. BTW, just because someone beat you to the punch on that 9th dan thing doesn't mean it isn't a worthy goal still, and maybe you can be a better one.

Qui, 9-Step Push is the first of Bak Mei's 3 original sets. Never heard of "butterfly stance". This may refer to the pidgeon-toed position of the feet as some teach, though I have found that this isn't really necessary. The reason for the sparsity of weapons is that being a southern art, it was originally practiced by people who weren't able to possess weapons or could only have those that were concealable (butterfly swords)or not apparent as weapons (staff). "Beggar hands" refers to a double Tan-Sao posture used for bridging. I've never heard that "3-arm" term before, but the way you describe it is the way we were taught to use our arms. The practice of jerking your opponent into your kick with at least one arm was referred to as "3-legged kick". As for your personal troll, I imagine if he had any balls, he'd be posting under his real name.

Qui, after re-reading your post, I'd like to add some points. "3-step Push" may refer to something like "Saam Bo Chin". As for the 2-man forms and such, our sticking hands are done while stepping, kicking and turning as well. Once basic sequences are ingrained into the nervous system through rote repetition, it is never again practiced this way but remains as free-fighting.

Actually, Chinese language doesn't have an alphabet.

True, symbols, but for want of a better word....

i hope but that was 2 years ago my new true goal now is finding true arts pure forms event hough my main study will continue to be pai lum i would like to one day train in an eagle claw system or but being stuck in massachusets is hard tournament this saturday ran by a crane school pai lum practicioners will be sparring i hope it will be fun take a look if you can there is no aplphabet but symbols but speaking is different from theyre reading and writing hell maybe ill try my hand at calighraphy maybe

Kenneth - Bamboo forest mantis sounds like a realy good system, how long have you been learning. Do you know of anybody practicing in the uk.I already know of paul whiterod and his people and have been meaning to go train chow gar with them. I had also heard a rumor that a highly respected bamboo forest mantis master was teaching the Hakka and Cantonese communities through the 70s and 80s in UK, but can find no info on any of his students.Many thanks

Qui, I started practicing it in 1985, but I wasted years trying brute force instead of proper body dynamics, etc.

About 2 years ago, a friend sent me a link to a website in UK, but I am unable to find it again. It was set up by someone who is not in the Lum Sang lineage, but the writing on the page shows the author knows what he is talking about. He may even be the one you are talking about, for all I know. Here, it is also referred to as "18 roads mantis", perhaps that will help. Sorry, I tried. I will contact my friend in Florida and see if he can remember how to get to that page.

Kenneth,

there is some truth but I have never seen similar techniques last when up against grappling, be it judo, shauijaio, jujitsu, etc.

Even the practitioner who so uphold his special training will grab the other!
an observation only.

Stan, actually, a lot of Hakka strategies are based on the standing clinch because so much of it is done close-in, with emphasis on clawing attacks to vital organs or blood vessels. There is even a ground-fighting element (Jook Lum's "monkey"), though it deals more with fighting a standing opponent while one is down. A few judo-like throws (Pak Mei's "ground fist"), a lot of elbow, neck and knee breaks, not much in the way of wrist twists like aikido however.

If you go back to the original karate applications, you will find much "tuite" or grappling techniques which have been sorely neglected by the modern, more sporterized forms. Most modern so-called martial arts specialize, but true combat arts used striking, grappling, weapons, psychology, etc. Also, I think it is easier for grapplers to develop realistic sparring methods than strikers. When I couldn't find anyone to stick hands with, I found the next best training partner, a judo instructor (check out my posts on the "phoenix-eye fist" thread on this forum). It's interesting to note that the few times we were talked into competing in local MA tournaments, we were almost always disqualified, and not because of "dirty strikes" like the Barney Fifes boast about, but because we had to use so much clinching in order to be truely doing our system.

massachusets tourneys are ajoke point sparrin is pathetic i quiot a tourny because wee had to wear full gear and still point spar its a joke

Point fighting was originally a way to practice more dangerous techniques, but with the advent of the competitive mindset came safety gear and rules that could be taken advantage of to win in ways that would never work in real life.

yup because all the kids do is hop around on 1 leg and try to tap the other guy on the head they dont break a sweat nor really compete they play a game is there any full contact tournys in mass

I was wonderin do you guys have any suggestion on a good way to practice with a boqan(sword hidden in case looks like cane dont know actuall spellin) i think its a wonderful weapon comment send a reply thank you

I do daily bokken (japanese wooden sword) consisting of raising and lowering 100-200 times 2-3 times/day. I practice stepping, turning, blocking, stabbing, etc.

Actual form gets monotonous and I enjoy the fast paced workout with push-ups a lot better than slow moving stuff! Sweating is good and it builds stamina.

i shoulf find a good way to practice i finally asked my sifu he showed me a form like the 7 deadly slahses but im still tryin to get chinese soft fist i was also wondering is thier an improper and proper way to hold swords ive seen two styles not to sure which is most effective rverse blade down arm or up with fist?